[Interview] What was the idea behind “delicious” pictograms?
- 株式会社フードピクト
- 4月9日
- 読了時間: 8分
The food ingredient display tool "FOODPICT" has been chosen to be implemented at the Osaka-Kansai Expo in 2025, marking the 20th anniversary of the initiative's launch.
Interviewer Matsuoka Maki spoke with Nobutaka Kikuchi, developer and CEO of FOODPICT Inc., and Nakayama Norika, a designer and director at NDC Graphics Inc. who has been involved in the design since its development, about the FOODPICT development process, the thoughts behind the pictograms, and expectations for the future.
Nobutaka Kikuchi
CEO of FOODPICT Inc.
- Born in Osaka in 1986
- Graduated from the School of Foreign Studies at Osaka University in 2009
- Completed the Diversity on the Arts Project at the Faculty of Fine Arts at Tokyo University of the Arts in 2023
- Works on problem solving and value creation using design and art
Nakayama Norika
Director and Designer, NDC Graphics Inc.
- Born in Osaka in 1969
- Graduated from the Design Department of Osaka Municipal Technical High School in 1988
- Joined Nippon Design Center immediately after graduating from Osaka Municipal Design Education Institute in 1990
- Participated in the establishment of NDC Graphics in 1993
- Involved in the creation of public information symbols and FOODPICT
― A company inspired by a bitter experience from my student days
Matsuoka: FOODPICT was born from your experience as a university student when you were unable to properly entertain Muslim guests with Japanese meals, right?
Kikuchi: That’s right. I went to a foreign language university and had the opportunity to eat with international students from various countries. When I went out to eat with vegetarian or Muslim international students, I sometimes had trouble finding a restaurant where we could eat together, or when I checked with the waiter before ordering and the food contained ingredients that they couldn't eat. It was this experience of hospitality failure in 2005 that prompted me to start working on FOODPICT.
― Turning to NDC Graphics, with its rich experience in pictograms to give shape to ideas
Matsuoka: I understand that you visited NDC Graphics to ask for their cooperation in the development of FOODPICT. What were your first impressions of each other?
Nakayama: I think the first time we met was in 2009 when Kikuchi visited our office. He was young but had a lot of experience, and I was surprised that he adopted "pictograms" as a way to solve food problems. Pictograms are familiar to us, but they’re a special design tool, so my first impression was that it was amazing that he linked them to that.
Kikuchi: I came up with the idea for FOODPICT when I was a student, and I came to consult with them about making it an international standard. When I entered the office, I was greeted by a creative space with a variety of works and large letterpress printing machines, and I felt that it was truly a design company. Nakayama-san was dressed in a fashionable suit, and my first impression was that he looked very stylish.
― Meeting with design director Kenzo Nakagawa
Kikuchi: Initially, we were assisted by Kenzo Nakagawa, who was the representative and design director of NDC Graphics at the time, and designer Nakayama.
Nakayama: I think Kikuchi must have found Nakagawa a little scary, since he wore a flashy tie and spoke in a loud Kansai dialect. The FOODPICTS were made possible thanks to his initial direction.
Kikuchi: Mr. Nakagawa has a certain aura about him, so I was nervous when I explained the concept of FOODPICT to him at our first meeting. I wasn’t sure if he would take on the design, and I was consulting with NDC Graphics, who has a wealth of experience in producing pictograms, so I was really fired up.
Nakayama: Nakagawa's style is to start by listening to what people have to say. Our job is primarily to solve problems through design together with people who want to make something but can't solve the problem themselves. I think Kikuchi's enthusiasm was conveyed in his explanation, and he readily agreed to work with us.
― FOODPICT was created based on the public information symbols that everyone sees
Matsuoka: Specifically, how did you go about creating FOODPICT?
Nakayama: Kikuchi suggested that he wanted to create food versions of public information symbols. Public information symbols are marks (pictograms) that are used in public spaces like train stations and airports, for things such as toilets and escalators, and whose meanings anyone can understand at a glance. The public information symbols that we created have now become JIS (Japanese Industrial Standards), and some of them are also registered with ISO (International Organization for Standardization) and are used all over the world.
― Commitment to "delicious" pictograms
Matsuoka: The shapes and colors of the FOODPICTS are wonderful.
Nakayama: "Let's make delicious pictograms" was the initial concept of FOODPICT. Although it was based on standard pictograms that anyone can understand, it had to look "delicious" because it was related to food. This was Nakagawa's initial direction.
For example, instead of just a square, we decided to round the edges. As for the colors, we wanted to make sure the design was easy for anyone to understand, so we used the brown color of curry and stew for the shapes of cows and pigs, and the color of custard cream for the background, to express “delicious” colors.
― Survey of 1,500 people worldwide to make FOODPICTS easier to understand
Matsuoka: I heard that in order to make FOODPICT internationally applicable, a survey was conducted on 1,500 people from various countries and regions regarding understanding, visibility, and necessary implementations.
Kikuchi: Yes, it was difficult at the time because there were almost no free online survey tools available. In a book that explained the production process of public information symbols, there was a survey method for comprehension and visibility, so I used that as a reference for conducting the survey. At the time, we printed out the survey form on A4 copy paper and had 750 Japanese people of various generations and 750 foreigners from over 20 countries respond.
We had a particularly hard time gathering foreign respondents. We conducted our surveys in a down-to-earth manner, sending questionnaires by international mail to vocational schools with many international students, company dormitories with many foreign staff members, and even to acquaintances studying abroad, and asking them to fill them out and send them back to us. It was an analog process that would be unthinkable today.
― Design that transcends cultural and regional differences
Matsuoka: Were there any FOODPICTS that were difficult to develop?
Kikuchi: We had a hard time coming up with pictograms for dairy products. At first, we designed milk collection cans used on farms, but the understanding rate of 1,500 people from around the world was low at 70%. We then changed the design to a milk carton, and the understanding rate rose to the 80% range. However, we also found that there are countries and regions in the world that don't use milk cartons.
In the end, we were able to raise the number to the 90% mark by drawing a cow on a bottle that has long been used for distribution in countries around the world. Pictograms are a tool for communicating beyond words, but we learned that they need to transcend not only language but also cultural and regional differences.
― FOODPICT changes with the times
Kikuchi: Also, in 2024, when macadamia nuts, newly designated as an item recommended for allergy labeling, were added to the FOODPICTS, we conducted another comprehension survey of all FOODPICTS to ensure that we could reflect current consumer sensibilities in the design.
Matsuoka: Were there any FOODPICTS whose understanding has changed compared to previous surveys?
Kikuchi: Based on the results of this survey, we made some slight changes to the gelatin design. Originally it was meant to look like a jelly mold, but perhaps due to the recent canelé craze, we noticed a lot of incorrect answers saying it was a canelé. So, rather than a canelé that is baked in a mold, we asked them to alter the design to show it sagging under the force of gravity, like a pudding or jelly.
Nakayama: It was difficult to improve comprehension of something that is difficult to visualize. Aside from gelatin, almonds and peanuts come to mind as nuts, but macadamia nuts are hard to imagine. Even when we looked at the prototype and tried to draw it, we received various opinions, such as it looking like chestnut, after doing some research, so we went through a process of trial and error, such as adding wrinkles, to improve comprehension.
― Changes due to the appearance of similar pictograms
Matsuoka: As we live in an age where there’s an increasing need to accommodate diverse food cultures and customs, we’re also seeing an increase in products and services similar to FOODPICT.
Kikuchi: Yes, to be honest, I was a bit impatient when they first came out. But looking back, when FOODPICT was the only product available, the method of displaying ingredients with pictograms was still a niche initiative, and its significance was hard to convey except in highly international locations such as international airports and conventions. On the other hand, I think that the emergence of competing products has led to the widespread use of pictograms for ingredients. In that sense, we are rivals who have worked hard together to improve ourselves, but we can also see each other as friends who have shaped the market together.
Nakayama: When I first saw similar products, I felt that ours had been created with more careful thought. Looking at the completeness of each pictogram and the overall balance, I was confident that FOODPICT's would be more cohesive.
Matsuoka: What does it mean to have a cohesive design?
Nakayama: I think of pictograms as a font. For example, the fonts you use on a daily basis include Arial and Times New Roman. In the same way, I think of pictograms as "emoji fonts." So, even when depicting different things in a pictogram, such as a cow, soybean, or gelatin, it’s necessary to unify them all in the same font.
For example, if you draw a cow in arial style and a soybean in times new roman style, it’ll give the overall impression of being disjointed. If there’s a font called "FOODPICT," you can create a design that matches the structure and atmosphere of the design within that font, and the overall result will be a solid, cohesive finish. This will create a sense of unity as a pictogram, making it easier for viewers to understand.
― Aiming for a world where everyone can enjoy eating worry-free
Matsuoka: It has also been decided that FOODPICT will be used at the Osaka-Kansai Expo, and will be featured on the menus of the restaurants that will be participating there.
Nakayama: I expect the Expo to be an event where FOODPICT can truly shine. I think this is a great opportunity to realize Kikuchi's original vision when he started working on FOODPICT: "Anyone can enjoy meals without worry." I've felt that FOODPICT has been used effectively at international conferences and other events up until now, so I hope that it will be used in many situations at the Expo and be well-received by people overseas.
Kikuchi: As Nakayama said, I think the ideal situation that we’ve envisioned since the very beginning of creating FOODPICT can be realized at the World Expo. Unlike international conferences such as the G20 and G7, the World Expo is an event that is open to the general public, so I hope it will become a tool that can be useful to many people.
I once again felt that I wanted to use the Expo as an opportunity to further promote and spread FOODPICT, including the thoughts of NDC Graphics and the other people involved in the development, as well as the people who sympathize with and use the product, such as hotels and food and beverage operators.
Interview date: January 22, 2025
Location: Online
Interviewer/writer: Maki Matsuoka (Matsuoka Planning)
Edited by: Ayaka Usui (SUICOU), Sosuke Yokoyama (g)
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